The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Placing a cam? Slotting a nut? Slinging a tree?
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The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by LK Day » Thu Dec 06, 2012 8:48 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLcoTnzyDew

Back in the day I was inspired by what I heard and read about climbing as practiced on the sandstone towers of East Germany and Czechoslovakia. Check out Alex Honnold's FA of the arete near the end. My old buddy Topher Donahue is in this video as well. Last time I climbed with Topher he was maybe 12 years old. Imagine an alt history for the RRG where everything is done East Euro style. There'd be far fewer routes, obviously, but they'd be real horror shows.

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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by Brentucky » Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:47 am

That wakes ya up just like a good dose of coffee.
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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by Jeff » Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:04 am

:shock:
No doubt 'tucky!
Then again, not much different than a day out with Jackson/Hammond.
Not that they like to run it out or minimize use of gear, its just they're so old, they usually forget to bring the gear.

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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by climb2core » Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:20 am

Or climbing trad with Kipp for that matter... gear placements for him is more for appearance than functionality.

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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by LK Day » Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:46 am

climb2core wrote:Or climbing trad with Kipp for that matter... gear placements for him is more for appearance than functionality.
So now we know why Kipp is always ragging on the trad. No good with the widgets. :D

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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by caribe » Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:46 pm

Is the stone too soft for cams and nuts or are these people Luddites/ die-hard traditionalists?

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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by Crankmas » Fri Dec 07, 2012 1:46 pm

I would say its tradition in the literal, where I have read over the years are there are bolts like they refer to but they are large, with rings that again are larger than a typical bolt hanger. The history predates modern protection and then with the influence of Soviet communism on the populace it probably made acquiring modern western climbing gear difficult. But, like their fellow climbers in the Soviet Union, Poland etc the spirit of climbers would not be broken and they carried on despite the hardships and rather than not climb they merely embraced the limitations as part of the game

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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by Crankmas » Fri Dec 07, 2012 1:50 pm

sorry for the typos but my guess is the rock would be more like the Red than say the New River or T-Wall

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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by clif » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:21 pm

looking at the formations and the color it's not like any sandstone i've seen. weird though how you get those basalt columns near the welded tuff out west, and at least 3 kinds of sandstone (Corbin, Wingate, ??). my first impression was of a gray/gneiss looking consistency?
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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by Crankmas » Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:55 pm

Hey Clif, I'm not a geologist though a few climbers I know are, the rock reminds me of the stone like on Half Moon and those type formations rather than say the tiered walls of T-Wall or the Nuttall sandstone of the New, maybe someone educated in that field could enlighten us. Still wild to see Honnold take on the arete like that when I normally think of his crack climbing prowess, that dude is a genuine badass and lets his actions do his talking.

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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by LK Day » Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:44 pm

It's soft sandstone alright. Wilford told me that a rope can cut a deep groove in the rock rather easily. That sounds a lot like the RRG. That's why they use massive ring bolts for pro. I'm pretty sure that the use of jammed knots arose as an alternative to pitons in a time before chocks were available. While I doubt that aluminum pieces would cause much more wear on the rock than jammed knots would generally, I can imagine cases where falling on a cam might blow off a thin flake where a jammed knot wouldn't. Still, I think it's mostly about their local tradition. They're ballsy mothers for sure.

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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by dfspau2 » Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:00 pm

The walls don't look like any volcanic (tuff) or any metamorphic (gniess) that I've ever seen... based on the formations/color they look like limestone, which I know east Germany has alot of... you can have quartz rich LS (calcareous sandstones basically which form in shallow beach environments) or non calcareous LS's that are harder (form in a lake bed environment)... take a look at formations in China or Thailand and you can get the same things... Its hard to say from the video though, or without having the rock in hand...
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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by dfspau2 » Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:02 pm

regardless, the guys who climb on the stuff, must have a hard time pulling their pants over their bowling sized balls
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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by LK Day » Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:12 pm

It is sandstone.
Numerous articles in climbing magazines over the years have called it sandstone.
First hand reports of the only two climbers that I know that have visited the area say it's sandstone.
The second line of narration in the video calls it sandstone.

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Re: The Birthplace of Bold Trad

Post by dfspau2 » Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:24 pm

tis true... its in the Elbe Sandstone Mountains of Germany
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