true story

Placing a cam? Slotting a nut? Slinging a tree?
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pigsteak
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true story

Post by pigsteak » Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:19 pm

Tbere is a very nice 45 degree slanting dibedral. The angle makes it very difficult to clean except on top rope. Climber 1 raps in and places gear on the way down to scrub the new line. Back on the ground, climber 1 pulls the rope and leads the pitch , falling once on his way to the chains. Climber 2 back ropes the climb, leaving the gear but doing the line no falls. Climber 1 pulls the rope again and leads on the pre placed gear doing the route clean. The climbers clean the route on backrope and go home feeling happy about the FA.

The next day the climbers are in formed that they have not done a FA but actually a FFA since the "send" was on in situ gear.

They go back the next day and climber 2 walks the route placing all the gear. climber 1 backropes and cleans. upon hitting the ground cimber 1 heads right back up and also sends placing all the gear.

now the confusion. did climber 1 get the fa when he sent the prior day on in situ gear or was it climber 2 when he placed all gear on lead?

sponsorship money is at stake here.
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Jeff
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Re: true story

Post by Jeff » Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:27 pm

What's a dibedral?

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Re: true story

Post by Spikeddem » Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:38 pm

The route saw an FA the first day.

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Re: true story

Post by whoneedsfeet » Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:44 pm

What's an FA?
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Re: true story

Post by climb2core » Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:51 pm

Ya got it backwards. The first day a FA was done, in the style of in situ gear by climber 1. On the second day, climber 2 did the FFA by placing all gear. The style of the FFA in the Red being established as leading and placing as you go. Give the credit to climber 2, for putting gear up on it. What is it, like a 5.8 anyways? Or quit worrying about splitting hairs and say you both did it.

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Re: true story

Post by pigsteak » Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:58 pm

so there was no FA by climber 1 his first burn when he fell once on the gear? or climber 2 back roping clean?

and for the guidebook, do we list the fa as everyone else does or list the ffa that will get changed by god to be the fa later on?
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Re: true story

Post by climb2core » Sat Dec 15, 2012 9:16 pm

pigsteak wrote:so there was no FA by climber 1 his first burn when he fell once on the gear? or climber 2 back roping clean?

and for the guidebook, do we list the fa as everyone else does or list the ffa that will get changed by god to be the fa later on?
IDK, I am not that smart. But I would give FA to climber 1 on his 2nd burn leading, not TR'ing. If the line can take protection and not be TR'd, then it isn't really an ascent.

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Re: true story

Post by LK Day » Sat Dec 15, 2012 9:24 pm

Who gives a fuck?

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Re: true story

Post by pigsteak » Sat Dec 15, 2012 9:29 pm

LK Day wrote:Who gives a fuck?
lmao...isnt the esteemed lday the one who says style matters???

for historical accuracy we all should care...or are you sayi ng that all your fa's here might have actually been top ropes larry?
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Re: true story

Post by One-Fall » Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:06 pm

Call me when you bolt it.
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Re: true story

Post by SCIN » Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:13 pm

Climber 1 got the FA but climber 2 gets his name in the guidebook as the FA.
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Re: true story

Post by pigsteak » Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:23 pm

thats what i thought ...seems that sporties have no problem with fa's on pre placed gear...just curious why a gear climb might have seperate rules...
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Re: true story

Post by rjackson » Sun Dec 16, 2012 12:04 am

pigsteak wrote:thats what i thought ...seems that sporties have no problem with fa's on pre placed gear...just curious why a gear climb might have seperate rules...
I think you have it backwards... Why does sport have separate rules from trad? And why does the guy that sets the bolts (the real protection) not get the FA and then the first climber to redpoint gets the FFA if they "place" their gear (draws?) on lead? Unless they bolt on lead, ground up, in good style, and not fall...

Personally, I'm coming around to Larry's point of view...
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Re: true story

Post by allah » Sun Dec 16, 2012 6:24 am

SCIN has never been a true sport climber!

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Re: true story

Post by LK Day » Sun Dec 16, 2012 6:48 am

Piggie, If you're really interested, I did the FA and FFA of four top-rope problems in the gorge. That short little crack on Rough Trail, Fallout, Meteor Maker and The Prow. Everything else was established on lead, placing gear as we went, even the drilled anchors on Meteor Maker (one) and The Prow (two or three if I recall correctly). When the explanation of the style in which a route was established gets too complicated to explain then it's definitely too complicated for me to care.

Trad climbing is simple. It's done from the ground up, sometimes with aid and then later freed, oftentimes (and preferably) free from the beginning. Before sport climbing took off in this country I tended to look at routes that had been established with too much messing around as having been "frigged". Jim Erickson used the word "tainted". So who cares who was the first to frig a route? Not me.

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