true story

Placing a cam? Slotting a nut? Slinging a tree?
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JR
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Re: true story

Post by JR » Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:57 pm

Will you guys stop proselytizing. Pigsteak doesn't need to climb F'ing Tower rock. He doesn't need to climb unknown dirt corners. Pigsteak needs to bolt. Bolt Piggy bolt!!!! Sniff out another Midnight Serf. Bolt. Grid Bolt. Go GO GO!!!!

JR
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Re: true story

Post by JR » Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:21 pm

Howie Feltersnatch wrote:
An argument could be made that by documenting your ascents and publishing them you are robbing the next generation of explorers of the opportunity to have the same experience you had. I was once told that I "owed it to the next generation of climbers" to document everything I have done so that they can know about these routes and follow them. I would argue that by documenting them I am assuring that a large portion of them cannot follow my experience because they will approach it with preconceived notions and too much information.

Interesting concept..... I kinda like it. So do a bunch of people. Take your rack into the woods and finds some cracks. Climb them. So simple and fun.

LK Day
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Re: true story

Post by LK Day » Thu Dec 20, 2012 12:06 am

Howie Feltersnatch wrote:The thing is Larry, Pigsteak can't go repeat your routes and have the same experience you are advocating as he will already know too much about each route before he leaves the ground. The only way he can understand what you love about rock climbing is to try and replicate your experience elsewhere; and maybe he already has and is simply trolling.

I don't know how pigsteak goes about developing new routes but I have done just a few myself and know this; absolutely nothing is as fulfilling as walking up to a gear line, becoming inspired, racking up and sending it with no inkling of what you might be getting yourself into other than what you can gather from the ground. You rely on your abilities to get yourself out of whatever jams you might get into. This to me is what defines the traditional form of rock climbing that emphasizes adventure, commitment, and the unknown above pure athleticism , rankings, and working toward attaining distant goals (which is also loads of fun and fulfilling). It is just another form of climbing like aid climbing, sport climbing, alpine and ice climbing, or bouldering; each with their own set of standards for how to approach them "fairly". The challenge shouldn't be to repeat 10 of Larry's routes but instead to go find 10 of your own gear routes that test your abilities and composure.

And then don't spray about them. New routes to onsight with absolutely no prior information are becoming less scarce all of the time. An argument could be made that by documenting your ascents and publishing them you are robbing the next generation of explorers of the opportunity to have the same experience you had. I was once told that I "owed it to the next generation of climbers" to document everything I have done so that they can know about these routes and follow them. I would argue that by documenting them I am assuring that a large portion of them cannot follow my experience because they will approach it with preconceived notions and too much information.

You wont find me disagreeing with you about "trad dads" on some accounts. Many of them simply hiding behind their inability to push themselves or reliving their old glory days (as is common in any recreational activity), but some of them are having experiences you can't have if you take out the element of the unknown.

Everything I have written so far is rambling and somewhat off topic but I have been looking for a way to express this for sometime and came to it by following the line of thinking that A) you shouldn't rap gear routes and take so much of the experience out of them and B) When you climb in an adventurous manner, and learn to not let your ego drive your climbing experience, but rather your sense of self fulfillment and adventure, then you won't give a shit who got the official First Fucking Ascent (I am assuming I understand the acronym FFA correctly).
Well put, Howie. I don't think you're off topic at all, and I pretty much agree with everything you said. A big part of Trad climbing is the sense of discovery. Finding and putting up your own routes is far and away the best experience, but I know I had a ton of fun repeating classic routes all over the west. It is important to not know too much about a climb before you do it, and a rap inspection would take away an awful lot of the unknown. Best to onsight for sure.

Now Piggie, one thing I realize is that the Red is far better suited to sport climbing than it is to trad. There must be many hundreds of truly outstanding sport lines in the Red and, what, dozens of good trad lines? You know what sport climbing is all about, trad in the Red is very, very different. Get your thug on, accept the fact that you're going to get dirty and get out there and brawl. You should have a blast.

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pigsteak
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Re: true story

Post by pigsteak » Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:53 am

couldnt agree more ynp. the red is truly special. hope you have a wonderful holiday season.
Positive vibes brah...positive vibes.

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Re: true story

Post by climb2core » Thu Dec 20, 2012 10:00 am

pigsteak wrote:couldnt agree more ynp. the red is truly special. hope you have a wonderful holiday season.
Kipp must be hitting the eggnog a little early today.

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Re: true story

Post by rjackson » Thu Dec 20, 2012 11:00 am

LK Day wrote: ...Get your thug on, accept the fact that you're going to get dirty and get out there and brawl. You should have a blast.
When others ask why I love trad climbing in the Red, this pretty much sums it up!
Pick myself up, stop lookin' back.
Grand Funk Railroad

Howie Feltersnatch
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Re: true story

Post by Howie Feltersnatch » Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:32 pm

JR wrote:Interesting concept..... I kinda like it. So do a bunch of people. Take your rack into the woods and finds some cracks. Climb them. So simple and fun.
Whoa! I wasn't trying to induce the masses to go find new gear routes! Just trying to convince one person interested in new routing that there are more than multiple ways to skin cats. And to talk a little about about conservation of limited resources over chest thumping. The last thing I want is every buckeye with a rack in the woods. :wink:

LK Day wrote: Get your thug on, accept the fact that you're going to get dirty and get out there and brawl. You should have a blast.
I'm not into tattoos but you might have just inspired me to tattoo a picture of myself inverted with the words "thug life" across my back.

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Re: true story

Post by Yasmeen » Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:36 pm

Howie Feltersnatch wrote:I'm not into tattoos but you might have just inspired me to tattoo a picture of myself inverted with the words "thug life" across my back.
This reminded me of a summer years ago at Grayson Lake. At the exact same time, Don McGlone and I saw this guy's back with "CANNONBALL" tattood across it in size 256 point font. Don slowly looks over at me and shrugs, "Seemed like a good idea at the time..."
"I snatched defeat from the jaws of victory." --Paul
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Howie Feltersnatch
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Re: true story

Post by Howie Feltersnatch » Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:33 pm

This was posted on MP by a man named Todd Wells from Chattanooga. You won't find Todd's name sprayed about because he doesn't operate with the intention of being recognized; do not doubt however, that he is the epitome of the original southern hardman. This is in reference to a petition to allow climbing on Signal Mountain and I felt some of it was pertinent to this area and this conversation.

"Climbing has been officially banned on Signal Mountain since 1992, long before there were "20 or so easily accessed routes" that, in the words of one poster, "were probably the reason that there is a climbing ban."
Historical illiteracy aside, if climbers truly want to gain legal access to Signal Mountain cliffs (or to any other closed climbing area), the first rule is to show some respect. Comments about cops and baked goods will get predictable laughs on a climbing site, but they are ultimately counterproductive and reflect the kind of immaturity, disrespect and spoiled sense of entitlement that land managers and owners associate with rock climbers in general.
To play the devil's advocate, why would Signal Mountain officials feel compelled to allow an activity whose practitioners contribute little (or nothing) to the town tax base which will be newly burdened by the activity the practitioners want to engage in? Especially when many of the practitioners act like arrogant children? And don't flatter yourself, there are plenty of cops who could hike in to bust you for climbing illegally on Signal Mountain. Wake up, the ban is about liability exposure and the allocation of limited town resources. To many town officials and residents, climbing is still a liability, not an asset despite the Boulder-of-the-East hype you've read in Outside Magazine. And no, the Signal Mountain cops probably won't hike in to bust you, but they may tow your car.
Let's be honest, though, the petition to allow rock climbing on Signal Mountain is really a petition to allow sport climbing on Signal Mountain. But given the inevitable trash, parking problems, leash-less dogs, car break-ins, irresponsible overuse and liability exposure associated with a high-use climbing area, why would Signal Mountain want to sanction the creation of something like a Leda within the town limits? Besides climber convenience, what's in it for Signal Mountain?
But there is a remedy to the climbing ban; it is a minimalist's approach. Learn to climb with minimal impact. Leave little or no trace of your passing. Climb ground up without a power drill, without the desire to create a "climbing area," without the desire to make a name for yourself. Be discrete. Learn some humility (others came before you, often climbing in better style). You may not get your name in Urban Climber this way, but you will be able to climb anywhere."

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Re: true story

Post by japones » Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:25 am

Howie Feltersnatch wrote: And then don't spray about them. New routes to onsight with absolutely no prior information are becoming less scarce all of the time. An argument could be made that by documenting your ascents and publishing them you are robbing the next generation of explorers of the opportunity to have the same experience you had. I was once told that I "owed it to the next generation of climbers" to document everything I have done so that they can know about these routes and follow them. I would argue that by documenting them I am assuring that a large portion of them cannot follow my experience because they will approach it with preconceived notions and too much information.

You wont find me disagreeing with you about "trad dads" on some accounts. Many of them simply hiding behind their inability to push themselves or reliving their old glory days (as is common in any recreational activity), but some of them are having experiences you can't have if you take out the element of the unknown.
.
Climbing without any beta is my preference. Just finding something that looks fun and climbing it (or getting shut down) beats the hell out of finding a certain route of a certain grade, length, style, etc. And finding 10 year old bail gear is super satisfying.

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Re: true story

Post by Cromper » Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:38 am

japones wrote:
Howie Feltersnatch wrote: And then don't spray about them. New routes to onsight with absolutely no prior information are becoming less scarce all of the time. An argument could be made that by documenting your ascents and publishing them you are robbing the next generation of explorers of the opportunity to have the same experience you had. I was once told that I "owed it to the next generation of climbers" to document everything I have done so that they can know about these routes and follow them. I would argue that by documenting them I am assuring that a large portion of them cannot follow my experience because they will approach it with preconceived notions and too much information.

You wont find me disagreeing with you about "trad dads" on some accounts. Many of them simply hiding behind their inability to push themselves or reliving their old glory days (as is common in any recreational activity), but some of them are having experiences you can't have if you take out the element of the unknown.
.
Climbing without any beta is my preference. Just finding something that looks fun and climbing it (or getting shut down) beats the hell out of finding a certain route of a certain grade, length, style, etc. And finding 10 year old bail gear is super satisfying.
Sounds like you're climbing to get pussy.

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Willy
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Re: true story

Post by Willy » Sat Dec 29, 2012 12:55 pm

I don't thing Japones has had pussy since pussy had him

Cromper
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Re: true story

Post by Cromper » Sat Dec 29, 2012 3:03 pm

Willy wrote:I don't thing Japones has had pussy since pussy had him
First firefighter to get pussy in the history of firefighters and or pussy.

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Re: true story

Post by whoneedsfeet » Sun Dec 30, 2012 12:02 am

Cromper wrote:
japones wrote:
Howie Feltersnatch wrote: And then don't spray about them. New routes to onsight with absolutely no prior information are becoming less scarce all of the time. An argument could be made that by documenting your ascents and publishing them you are robbing the next generation of explorers of the opportunity to have the same experience you had. I was once told that I "owed it to the next generation of climbers" to document everything I have done so that they can know about these routes and follow them. I would argue that by documenting them I am assuring that a large portion of them cannot follow my experience because they will approach it with preconceived notions and too much information.

You wont find me disagreeing with you about "trad dads" on some accounts. Many of them simply hiding behind their inability to push themselves or reliving their old glory days (as is common in any recreational activity), but some of them are having experiences you can't have if you take out the element of the unknown.
.
Climbing without any beta is my preference. Just finding something that looks fun and climbing it (or getting shut down) beats the hell out of finding a certain route of a certain grade, length, style, etc. And finding 10 year old bail gear is super satisfying.
Sounds like you're climbing to get pussy.
Yeah cromper only climbs to get dick.
Skipping cruxes is a way of life.

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Re: true story

Post by MYDADPULLEDOUT » Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:16 pm

Gay jokes aren't funny. FAGOT

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