How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Gaston? High Step? Drop Knee? Talk in here.

How to use Perma-draws in the Red

None
9
17%
Anchors only
1
2%
Anchors and midway point to facilitate cleaning steep routes
13
24%
Anchors, midway points, and hard clips
3
6%
Mixed approach depending on overhang angle
24
44%
Entire routes
4
7%
 
Total votes: 54

aburgoon
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How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by aburgoon » Fri Oct 21, 2011 9:03 am

Hi All,

Rather than simply arguing a false dichotomy, lets vote to see where the community stand on the issue. Obviously this vote is non-binding, and you are able to change your vote anytime you like.
Last edited by aburgoon on Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

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climb2core
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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by climb2core » Fri Oct 21, 2011 9:14 am

This is not always so straight forward... I want to choose fully equipped on very steep, cleaning for moderate steep, an anchors only for less than steep. How do I do that?

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by dustonian » Fri Oct 21, 2011 9:21 am

Yeah, it depends on the individual route.

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by aburgoon » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:25 am

Mixed approach added to poll. Thanks for the heads up.

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by aburgoon » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:26 am

Apparently when I added a field to the poll it erased the previous votes.

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by toad857 » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:48 am

No two routes are the same.

In any case, I give you props for attempting to reach a consensus with the community, rather than tactlessly behaving like a rebel.

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by aburgoon » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:58 am

Thanks for the props, but honestly speaking I wouldn't have made this poll had they not taken down the draws. I think we can use this opportunity to create a more respectful and safer climbing community and area. The more people who contribute their thoughts the better.

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by THB » Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:04 am

So far it seems apparent. As of right now 63% of the people that voted in the other thread feel that stripping the draws from the lode was a BAD idea. That's a clear majority. And it seems so far on this thread that the majority (70% out of only 10 voters so far), feels that we need to equip routes in with perma-draws based on a mixed approach depending on the steepness of the route...

But, where do we draw the line? Thanks for posting this thread aburgoon, it's about time we stop all the back-and-forth bickering, and put that energy toward a solution. Is the meeting still on for 8pm at Miguel's tomorrow (saturday) night? If so, can I volunteer myself to be the moderator of the meeting. I really don't want to see it turn into a pissing match, i'd like to see the community come back together and make a decision that we can all agree on with this topic. hopefully by the end of the night we'll all be holding hands and singing kumbayah (sp?)...

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by dustonian » Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:05 am

Yah, bickering is way homo. I recommend climbing cracks until at least Nov 15.

P.S. THE LURKIST is going to moderate your skinny white ass!

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by aburgoon » Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:23 am

THB wrote:So far it seems apparent. As of right now 63% of the people that voted in the other thread feel that stripping the draws from the lode was a BAD idea. That's a clear majority. And it seems so far on this thread that the majority (70% out of only 10 voters so far), feels that we need to equip routes in with perma-draws based on a mixed approach depending on the steepness of the route...

But, where do we draw the line? Thanks for posting this thread aburgoon, it's about time we stop all the back-and-forth bickering, and put that energy toward a solution. Is the meeting still on for 8pm at Miguel's tomorrow (saturday) night? If so, can I volunteer myself to be the moderator of the meeting. I really don't want to see it turn into a pissing match, i'd like to see the community come back together and make a decision that we can all agree on with this topic. hopefully by the end of the night we'll all be holding hands and singing kumbayah (sp?)...
Remember that the people voting here do not represent the totality of climbers at the red, so we can't use this voting as a source of legitimacy for any group.

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by dustonian » Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:24 am

What is the standard deviation and margin of error???

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by tbwilsonky » Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:33 am

dustonian wrote:What is the standard deviation and margin of error???
ha. the font suggests this study is probably peer-reviewed.

in all seriousness, i really like the idea of full equip for mega-steep, mid and anchors on semi-steep, and anchors on not steep.
haunted.

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by ynp1 » Fri Oct 21, 2011 11:47 am

i think the bolter and/or FAest should make the call... they decide if a route needs bolts and where, why not decide if it needs PDs or not???
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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by TradMike » Fri Oct 21, 2011 12:22 pm

You also need to take into account whether it is public land (NFS, Park, etc.) or private land. Leaving fixed gear on public land is self centered and disrespectful to a degree vs. private land where the owner can decide what they want to allow. I think bolts have been tolerated on public land but the PDs on public land are definitely viewed as trash by some land managers. They do make it too convenient and it does bring a crowd. The impact from crowds bring a lot of attention and the kind you don't want. The more we push into this area the more likely areas will be closed to climbing. Climbers can disagree all they want but ultimately it will come down to who owns or manages the land and what they want. Clint Eastwood comes to mind, “You've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well, do ya punk?" Some popular public areas are going to more and more strict permits limiting numbers due to impact.

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Re: How to apply Fixed gear in the Red

Post by climb2core » Fri Oct 21, 2011 12:27 pm

TradMike wrote:You also need to take into account whether it is public land (NFS, Park, etc.) or private land. Leaving fixed gear on public land is self centered and disrespectful to a degree vs. private land where the owner can decide what they want to allow. I think bolts have been tolerated on public land but the PDs on public land are definitely viewed as trash by some land managers. They do make it too convenient and it does bring a crowd. The impact from crowds bring a lot of attention and the kind you don't want. The more we push into this area the more likely areas will be closed to climbing. Climbers can disagree all they want but ultimately it will come down to who owns or manages the land and what they want. Clint Eastwood comes to mind, “You've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well, do ya punk?" Some popular public areas are going to more and more strict permits limiting numbers due to impact.
Pretty sure the question is meant only where the land owner has no position on fixed gear.

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