Does plumb make the line?

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climb2core
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Does plumb make the line?

Post by climb2core » Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:00 am

You guys think lines that follow a direct plumb line are better? Should routes not be bolted if they can't follow a straight and vertical line?

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by Andrew » Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:29 am

I was thinking about commenting on this topic in the online guide but this seems to be a better forum. In my worthless opinion, the answer to this question is unique to the RRG. In many other destinations plumb lines are hard to come by, but at the red nearly all the routes are plumb. Because of this I often enjoy non-plumb lines more because of their unique experience. This may also have to do with the fact that much of the RRG's plumb lines require boring right left right left jug hauling, so routes that wander often have better movement. I hope this makes sense.

So the answer is... bolt all rock.
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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by der uber » Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:36 am

This is a no brainer. The worst part about a meandering line is probably the rope drag. Even with that, you can make up for it with good bolt placement, long draws, directionals.

just to name a few great routes that aren't straight up.

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And I have never thought or heard anyone say "yes this route is really good, because it follows a plumb line"

That ne line at beer trailer, Darkness Falls (I think) is supposed to be pretty cool, and if I remember correctly that angles right most of the way up.

To pig back on Andrew, if it's a good line, bolt it.

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by allah » Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:50 am

Its all about the line of least resistance! Thats what a plumb line means to me. wandering or not

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by dustonian » Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:50 am

here is a picture of what many regard as the "best rock climb in the world"...
123515_9393_L.jpg
123515_9393_L.jpg (74.44 KiB) Viewed 3750 times

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by dustonian » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:20 am

der uber wrote:This is a no brainer. The worst part about a meandering line is probably the rope drag. Even with that, you can make up for it with good bolt placement, long draws, directionals.

just to name a few great routes that aren't straight up.

Paradise Lost
Rebar
Black gold
Jesus Wept

And I have never thought or heard anyone say "yes this route is really good, because it follows a plumb line"

That ne line at beer trailer, Darkness Falls (I think) is supposed to be pretty cool, and if I remember correctly that angles right most of the way up.

To pig back on Andrew, if it's a good line, bolt it.
Darkness Falls for sure... excellent route! Don't forget about Table of Colors, American Dream, Tuskan Raider, Beer Belly, and Taste the Rainbow...

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by returntosender » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:25 am

dustonian wrote: Darkness Falls for sure... excellent route! Don't forget about Table of Colors, American Dream, Tuskan Raider, Beer Belly, and Taste the Rainbow...
And the noob classic The Offering.

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by dustonian » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:27 am

returntosender wrote: And the noob classic The Offering.
Haha nice one. Also Belly of the Beast... essentially a harder version of the Icebreaker roof start.

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by Cromper » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:40 am

I think the creator of this thread is stirring up a big ol pot of shit. Grid bolt the world!!

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by dustonian » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:48 am

Your mom is stirrin' up a big ol pot of shit. What time is dinner?

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by Cromper » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:51 am

dustonian wrote:Your mom is stirrin' up a big ol pot of shit. What time is dinner?
She's got a crock pot goin today. Gonna be a long stinky day today but it makes the turds so tender!!

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by climb2core » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:52 am

The basis of any good thread is pot stirring. At least that is what your mom said last night.

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by der uber » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:53 am

dustonian wrote: Darkness Falls for sure... excellent route! Don't forget about Table of Colors, American Dream, Tuskan Raider, Beer Belly, and Taste the Rainbow...
Yeah thanks for reminding me, beer Belly for sure.

This is the dumbest thread since the "Least hospitable base of a route" one. dumber even I say [sniff]!

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by Spikeddem » Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:34 pm

der uber wrote:And I have never thought or heard anyone say "yes this route is really good, because it follows a plumb line"
You gotta be crazy! You've never heard anyone say this? I mean, replace "plumb" with "really direct" and I think I hear it fairly regularly. IMO, it often affects the aesthetics of a route as a result of probability. We often enjoy low-probability things because they have a sense of being special, and this is definitely the case on direct lines with few other routes to either side.

Plumb lines at the lode: not so special.
Plumb lines like King Me: a bit more special.

So, I guess I would say I have to take into account the isolation of the route, too.

That being said, I wouldn't say to skip bolting a route because it wasn't plumb. Welcomed Guest is a nice route that dog legs hard, but is still definitely worth the bolts IMO.

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Re: Does plumb make the line?

Post by dustonian » Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:37 pm

I dunno, King Me kinda doglegs left at the roof start, then right, then doglegs left again on the upper slab before going back right to the anchor... therefore, it is clearly choss. And don't even get me started on obvious piles like Super Dario, Amarillo Sunset, Air-Ride Equipped, No Redemption, Crosley, Black Gold, & Abiyoyo!!

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