Roadside Crag Open??

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toad857
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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by toad857 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:32 am

dustonian wrote:I appreciate your opinion, and would also appreciate leaving out the ad hominem insults and name-calling. What you've left out of your post is history: that the current landowners didn't purchase the land until 2004, and that there were few to no access issues until they chose to close it. That said, I admire and agree with the landowners' stated intentions, and in the context of our current system (see below), I hope they stay true to the ideals they have put forth on http://www.gfnp.org.

I disagree that the crag has been severely damaged by recreational use, although some routine maintenance is certainly in order. Furthermore, the notion of "getting the property back to a natural state" is naive and in some ways impossible in a region historically devastated by 99% deforestation, unrestrained resource/oil exploitation, groundwater contamination, neglect, off-road vehicular abuse, and invasive species run rampant.

Roadside is a beautiful jewel in the midst of all that, loved and maintained for decades by a community of climbers and before that, native Americans. Yes, there are erosion issues at the base of some walls, as is the case at popular climbing (or biking or hiking) areas around the world, and better infrastructure is needed to support the soil. But I fundamentally disagree with the concept that the acquisition of property alone justifies the abrupt closure of land that has been open to the public essentially forever. In European countries and other developed nations, this idea is called "Freedom to Roam"; unfortunately, citizens have no such rights in the United States, despite our posturing towards liberty et cetera... in other words, "If they can buy it, they can close it."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_to_roam
Well said.

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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by rjackson » Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:37 am

dustonian wrote:...this whole thing is like a bad joke...
+1
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toad857
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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by toad857 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:00 am

To be fair, the owners of roadside do have full-time jobs. They're busy; maybe they haven't gotten around to developing a management plan, much less implementing it. Or offering a clue to the community. I want to give them the benefit of the doubt. I really do...

But the whole guiding thing is pretty suspicious. If they don't want to chime in and address the community, then that's fine... but they should know that there is a message being sent amidst their silence. Kind of like a subtle middle finger. A subtle one, but a middle finger nonetheless.

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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by TradMike » Tue Mar 13, 2012 12:01 pm

Yeah, those spandex suits that bikers wear sure are ghey.

dustonian
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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by dustonian » Tue Mar 13, 2012 12:12 pm

I didn't mean it in the homosexual way, because there's nothing wrong with that. I meant more in the bad Broadway musical costume kind of way. One show in New York the riggers were visible to the audience, so we had to do the entire show in monkey suits, every night. Kind of like that.

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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by TradMike » Tue Mar 13, 2012 12:44 pm

It is gay when you stretch a thin layer of shape conforming material over your junk and then ride around with your junk at eye level for everyone to see. I think this qualifies as gay, not that there is anything wrong with that.

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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by toad857 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:05 pm

exactly!

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pigsteak
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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by pigsteak » Tue Mar 13, 2012 2:06 pm

dude, the spandex era is no worse than all these jean wearing chuffers today. all about pretend wannabee style hounds trying to pull off the subtle cool attitude.
Positive vibes brah...positive vibes.

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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by Crankmas » Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:40 pm

ahhh.... yeah... rabble rabble rabble ghey style hound jean wearing chuffers who wanna go do ro and call it 12

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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by c-foot » Tue Mar 13, 2012 7:17 pm

Wow, such hatred on the jeans. Some of the least fashion conscious climbers I know wear jeans to the crag. That's right Clif. I'm calling you out. Myself, I prefer to wear a little something like this. I find it to be very comfortable and airy, although sometimes harness chaffing can be an issue. Plus, the ladies love it.
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clif
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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by clif » Tue Mar 13, 2012 8:17 pm

is that muscle beach?
training is for people who care, i have a job.

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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by Josephine » Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:10 pm

Yasmeen wrote:http://www.redriverclimbing.com/viewtop ... 28&t=14083 - posted Tue May 24, 2011 at 8:02 am
http://www.caverunbikeshop.com - Updated 5/26/11
Interesting to look at the dates on these. I didn't notice that on my first perusal.
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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by caribe » Tue Mar 13, 2012 11:21 pm

Wow, I feel betrayed. I had a feeling about this deal from almost the beginning. Not much about it made much sense. I only drank half cup of the kool-aid before I spat. Now at least some of the math is working out, but can you really make that much ka-ching guiding Roadside? Really? So this story still is not quite adding up.
- I am tripping on the original warning at the Graining Fork website, it went something like, "and don't even think about guiding here!"

- Another aspect of all this of course is that the Red wins at the drama contest. There is no other climbing venue with the drama that we command at the Red. I can't wait to see how this story plays in the climbing mags. I am also wondering what the hell is next. Does this saga get weirder?

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cliftongifford
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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by cliftongifford » Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:56 am

dustonian wrote:Guiding is fine work if you have a trust fund...
I've had a job since I was 15. No trust fund here. Guiding is my seasonal/part-time, second job.

You guys are going nuts based on suspicion. It's kinda funny.
Roadside will be open soon enough, it's not a permanent closure...

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milspecmark
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Re: Roadside Crag Open??

Post by milspecmark » Wed Mar 14, 2012 9:58 am

Ok, I am ready for Clevis already.

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